Advice on harvest

[vinconco]

Here are some pics I took this evening of 4 types I'm growing. I need some help on when to start priming
My first frost date is 9/30/14

Izmir Ozbas
planted 7/5/14
topped 8/15/14



TN90 Burley
Planted 7/5/14
Topped 8/15/14



Catterton
Planted 7/9/14
Topped 8/15/14



VA 116
Planted 7/9/14
topped 8/15/14

 

[Mad Oshea]

Looks like You have the grow down Now the curring .

 

[deluxestogie]

They all look great, and surprising for such a late planting.

Here are my guesses about their current status:

• Izmir Ozbas: wait for a slight yellow tip, then prime the leaves 3 or 4 at a time, starting at the bottom
• TN90 Burley: you could prime the lowest leaves now, then wait for most of the plant to yellow somewhat, before stalk harvesting
• Caterton: I would wait another week, then stalk harvest.
• VA116: I see yellow tips all the way to the top. You could begin priming now.

Everyone's opinions on the perfect time to harvest various varieties differs.

Bob

 

[vinconco]

Thanks for the feedback Bob. When stalk harvesting the Catterton, would you wilt the plants in the sun? how long?

 

[deluxestogie]

I'm not sure how BigBonner harvests his Maryland varieties. I would be inclined to just hang it in the shed, if the humidity is not too high. I drive a nail diagonally near the base of each stalk, to use as a hook for hanging stalk-harvested plants on a taut Nylon rope in the shed. Once the stems relax, they can be spaced more closely on the rope.

Bob

 

[Brown Thumb]

Very nice plants, when I stalk harvest I let them lay out in the field for most of the day to wilt.
That way they don't take up as much room when hanging and you don't break the leaf off.

 

[istanbulin]

Bob is right on priming İzmir Özbaş. Actually two months are enough for this variety to prime the lower leaves but topping and wide spacing probably postponed the maturity time. Lower temperatures of late fall may cause poor curing so you may need a little warmer place to cure them.

 

[Ben Brand]

What I do is cut them late afternoon, leave them for the evening and hang them the next morning, I only do it that way because in SA the sun is to fierce to leave them lying in the day, Sun burn

 

[vinconco]

Does stalk harvesting tolerate lower temps and humidity during color curing than primed leaves? I'm hoping the residual moisture in the stalk will keep the leaves from drying green if the conditions are not ideal.

 

[istanbulin]

I'm sure there're people who can answer your question about stalk curing, I do not have enough experience about that.

When it comes to Orientals (in this case İzmir Özbaş), even the humidity is not very low they may dry green under low temperatures. I don't know how is the weather (temps. etc.) in late fall there but you may need a warmer place for curing.

 

[Mad Oshea]

I am in New Mexico, I do not stalk cure any of them. I water the grass very well, and I fling the leaf all over it for the heat of the sun on it to wilt the leaf. When I am done. I drink a soft drink (beer or tea) then tie it to 1/2 emt at 1/2 inches apart. The leaf is saggy and wilted perfect for the tie. It is a steam wilt. The Catteron acts like the Silver River. When a leaf turns over like the one in the picture, I start the prime. It will roll back after the bottom leaf is gone. (on Mine)

 

[vinconco]

I am in New Mexico, I do not stalk cure any of them. I water the grass very well, and I fling the leaf all over it for the heat of the sun on it to wilt the leaf. When I am done. I drink a soft drink (beer or tea) then tie it to 1/2 emt at 1/2 inches apart. The leaf is saggy and wilted perfect for the tie. It is a steam wilt. The Catteron acts like the Silver River. When a leaf turns over like the one in the picture, I start the prime. It will roll back after the bottom leaf is gone. (on Mine)

My Catterton started turning the leaves weeks ago even before they started to bud. I didn't know if it was normal since it's my first grow for Catterton.

 

[Mad Oshea]

Just prime the bottom and watch. Mine do it alot.

 

[CT Tobaccoman]

Does stalk harvesting tolerate lower temps and humidity during color curing than primed leaves? I'm hoping the residual moisture in the stalk will keep the leaves from drying green if the conditions are not ideal.

From experience with Conn Broadleaf, yes. Primed leaves are not really supposed to be air cured--they need heat quick to shrink the veins--Turkish tobacco excepted, I guess.

But I have known broadleaf (stalk cut) to stay hanging in the curing shed all winter in the old days, 1960s, when we used to rely on damp weather for taking leaves and plants down after curing. Some autumns would be very dry, and if it rained on Thanksgiving or Christmas everybody would have to work taking down. Now the tobacco is steamed after curing and taken down on schedule.

But stalk cut tobacco cures more slowly than primed leaves. It seems like it cures itself--you don't have to worry much about it. Excess humidity is the enemy. There is a lot of moisture n the stalk and stems to dissipate.

 

[CT Tobaccoman]

Vinconco,

Why do you want to prime burley? As far as I know it is a stalk cut type, generally air cured. All I really know is Connecticut, and we only prime the shade and cure it with heat. The broadleaf and Havana seed are stalk cut and air cured--some heat might be needed during a very rainy fall. Since burley leaves are not wrapper leaves or flue cured leaves generally, why bother to prime them?

Some of you do prime burley, I know. Why?

CT

 

[vinconco]

Vinconco,

Why do you want to prime burley? As far as I know it is a stalk cut type, generally air cured. All I really know is Connecticut, and we only prime the shade and cure it with heat. The broadleaf and Havana seed are stalk cut and air cured--some heat might be needed during a very rainy fall. Since burley leaves are not wrapper leaves or flue cured leaves generally, why bother to prime them?

Some of you do prime burley, I know. Why?

CT

I read somewhere on here that priming the lower leaves earlier kept them from getting overripe waiting for the top leaves to ripen. The more overripe burley is the harsher it gets was the reasoning.

I think that burley is stalk harvested for commercial reasons. Stalk curing gets the tobacco in the barn quicker and it can be processed later during the winter down time.

 

[deluxestogie]

You can successfully stalk-cut or leaf-prime any tobacco. Burley air-cures just fine when primed. My reason for priming the lowest burley leaves, while stalk-cutting the rest is because by the time the entire plant is ready to be stalk-cut, the lowest leaves have become tattered trash.

I have leaf-primed CT Broadleaf. It color-cures well.

A justification for stalk-cutting is that it takes less attention and harvesting time (labor costs) and requires about 1/2 the square footage of curing space--single tier--(curing costs). If the quality of the resulting leaf is the same, whether stalk-cut or leaf-primed, then I stalk-cut. For the best quality wrapper leaf, I always prime, regardless of the commercial harvesting preference.

For me, the curing space advantage is a plus for stalk-cutting. But carrying 8-10 pound plants from the garden bed to the shed is sometimes an ordeal. The taller ones need to be held with my arms fully extended at 45º. After the 4th or 5th trip back and forth, it gets old.

Bob

 

[vinconco]

Bob .. I'm having a late season and it's been a cool summer. I'm in the middle of harvesting and the temps at night are in the high 40's and daytime under 70. Will stalk harvesting make color curing easier in cool temps? I'm already having to pile color my primed leaves.

 

[Mad Oshea]

I prime all of My plants, sometimes early. I cure them,the same as the whole plant at the end of the season. Never had an issue with them on it. Just that the bottom leaf gets the brunt of hell, and looks like crap. The flavor is the same in the most as the upper leaf. I would go with delux. on Your area in how. Mad-

 

[CT Tobaccoman]

You can successfully stalk-cut or leaf-prime any tobacco. Burley air-cures just fine when primed. My reason for priming the lowest burley leaves, while stalk-cutting the rest is because by the time the entire plant is ready to be stalk-cut, the lowest leaves have become tattered trash.

I have leaf-primed CT Broadleaf. It color-cures well.

A justification for stalk-cutting is that it takes less attention and harvesting time (labor costs) and requires about 1/2 the square footage of curing space--single tier--(curing costs). If the quality of the resulting leaf is the same, whether stalk-cut or leaf-primed, then I stalk-cut. For the best quality wrapper leaf, I always prime, regardless of the commercial harvesting preference.

For me, the curing space advantage is a plus for stalk-cutting. But carrying 8-10 pound plants from the garden bed to the shed is sometimes an ordeal. The taller ones need to be held with my arms fully extended at 45º. After the 4th or 5th trip back and forth, it gets old.

Bob

I see. Now I understand. It's true that the bottom leaves on my burley were starting to cure "on the vine" when I cut it down. I guess curing stalk cut plants is just easier. The extra time and trouble to pick and properly cure individual leaves doesn't seem justified to me unless it is going to be cigar wrapper. That's just my mindset, I guess. I tend to think in terms of a big crop even with only a few plants.

Now, I've cured individual broadleaf leaves that happened to fall off the wagon--we would get a few hundred of those in each shed. I always felt that they dried too fast and that their color would have been better had they not been separated from the stalk.

Air curing shade like I do, picking some leaves on a big farm and taking them home, never works as well as the customary heat cure. The veins can't be shrunk without repeated dry outs with heat. Maybe this time, after I achieve the right color in the lamina I'll put them in the oven and make them crispy dry. Then they will re-humidify with the weather and remaining moisture in the stem and veins will spread into the lamina. Then to the oven again. That at least would mimic what happens to shade on a "real" farm. Actually, that sounds like a plan. Air cured shade that I have from previous years have way big veins. Once the right color is set, I can concentrate on those veins. We'll see how that works.