Blending

[Freeotatv]

Thanks for taking the time leverhead...

triggered a few questions

what do you mean by fighting burley...was it the toasting part of burley?

Is it possible to get a similiar taste from va bright leaf if you air cure it rather than flue cure it...or is the flue curing required to obtain the flue cured flavor?

 

[leverhead]

Thanks for taking the time leverhead...

triggered a few questions

what do you mean by fighting burley...was it the toasting part of burley?

Is it possible to get a similiar taste from va bright leaf if you air cure it rather than flue cure it...or is the flue curing required to obtain the flue cured flavor?

"Fighting Burley" I had tried toasting it, casing it and leaving it alone, not enough gain for the amount of work (for me). I could get an interesting "full flavor" from Mariland and dark air-cured leaving the Burley out.

I haven't air-cured a Virginia, I have Sun-cured the same variety (Southern Beauty) that I flue-cured. It wasn't as sweet as when flue-cured and had more of a "full flavor". I liked it, the wife didn't. Her involvement is little more than critical comments and smoking.

 

[Freeotatv]

Thanks man...the last line was pretty funny

 

[leverhead]

Thanks man...the last line was pretty funny

Marriage is a slow death.

 

[jwit76]

Good info letterhead, thank you. So this weekend I'll have shredded the following: red, Bright, 1st priming, prilep and Maryland. If I'm going for an american style full flavor smoke, what would be a good way to start? Perhaps mixing however many grams of red and Maryland, then adding a small percentage of the others one at a time and taking note of the changes? Just thinking it through.

A quick observation this morning, I had a marlboro red that was broken in half so I decided to stuff it into one of my premiere full flavor tubes. I was quite astounded at the difference, although it was packed with similar density it was a completely different smoke. It confirmed my suspicions that these commercial tubes are engineered to a greater degree than what I had considered, I believe scent treatment and probably more.

 

[leverhead]

Good info letterhead, thank you. So this weekend I'll have shredded the following: red, Bright, 1st priming, prilep and Maryland. If I'm going for an american style full flavor smoke, what would be a good way to start? Perhaps mixing however many grams of red and Maryland, then adding a small percentage of the others one at a time and taking note of the changes? Just thinking it through.

A quick observation this morning, I had a marlboro red that was broken in half so I decided to stuff it into one of my premiere full flavor tubes. I was quite astounded at the difference, although it was packed with similar density it was a completely different smoke. It confirmed my suspicions that these commercial tubes are engineered to a greater degree than what I had considered, I believe scent treatment and probably more.

Tubes make a big difference! I tried a few different brands/styles and have settled on Zig-Zag red kings, they're easy to get and work well. Of what I tried, D&R Windsail tubes were the best, they had a 20mm filter but too muck ink on the paper. I've purchased one box of Premier tubes, I liked them so much that I still have most of the box left. The paper is wimpy and the filter is too short, but they are cheap.

If I had to tell someone where to start blending......

Start with each of your flue-cured, separately. Flue-cured will probably be the biggest part of your blend, getting it roughed in will make the rest pretty strait forward. Try real hard to keep your normal smoking pace, even if it takes you an hour or two to get through them. Take notes of your likes/dislikes, burning speed and time to your next smoke. The last part will give you some idea of how much nicotine your getting.

From there, you could try equal amounts or an educated guess as a blend to see if they do what you want. If you want to end up with a milder blend for your wife, this may or not be a good place to get her opinion. If you tweak the flue-cured blend to her liking, add 15% Prilep and let her smoke it for a few days while you work on your blend.

The only thing you have left to work with is Maryland, add a small amount. Make enough for a day's smokes, at the end of the day you'll have a pretty good idea if you want more or less for the next day.

Once I left commercial cigarettes behind, my tastes and cravings changed. I (we) smoke about 2/3 as much and enduring a smoke free world is easier.

 

[jwit76]

So after reading countless number of posts regarding blending, toasting and casing, here are a few trends I've noticed:

Maryland or Burley - most seem to agree that it is beneficial to toast and the suggestions range between 250 deg - 300 deg for anywhere between 30 min - 90 min.

Flue cured VA (red, bright, 1st priming) and oriental - most seem to agree toasting is NOT beneficial, however in the casing forum some prescribe spraying ones preferred casing and then toasting at 250 deg for 5 min, then spraying again, then perhaps another 5 min. This appears to be the extent of what most would consider toasting VA or oriental. I had found a link that recommended toasting all WLT, but again it seems contrary to popular opinion, here's the link: http://fumo-bros-tobacco.com/how-to-process-whole-leaf-tobacco.html

Let me know if I'm on the right track here. thanks

 

[Knucklehead]

I don't toast or case, but I use aged tobacco. That makes a big difference in flavor. My burley is about five years old now and not harsh.

 

[Freeotatv]

Whenever ive toasted i get yelled at....according to someone else in the house(no names mentioned) "it stinks"

No taste improvement using a va flue blend/md/dark/prilep..like with anything else...taste preference...some may prefer it.

according to the doc i posted in the casing forum....toasting is used by commercial brands to regain the fill power of the shred which is lost after it is cased/glycerin sprayed/top flavored...that being said all folks seem to be saying burley needs to be toasted to take the bite outta it

 

[jwit76]

First batch results, toasted red, Bright, 1st priming and prilep for 30 min at 265 deg. Then toasted my Maryland for 60 min at 300 deg. Concocted a casing of coco, licorice, vanilla, sugar and water, cased liberally. Blended 2 tbs of bright and red, 1 tbs of 1st priming, and 1.25 tbs of Maryland. Wife agreed that taste was superb as compared to anything I've blended so far (yedi-turkish), including taste as compared to recent samplings of nat sherman classics and winstons. I suspect after letting the baccy rest a few days and adjusting the proportions, it will only get better. Right out of the gates I'm impressed.

Things I'd like to improve = more substantial/thicker body. A more flat line/consistent nic hit vs the spike that wlt is known for. Not sure how to move the needle in these areas, but something to research. Still love the taste of my reds, but I can tell I'm moving in the right direction for my preferences.

 

[jwit76]

How would you describe the difference in taste between the "Fire Cured Va" and the "Dark Air"? I'm considering adding one of the two as an experimental flavor leaf with my bright, red, prilep, and Maryland. I'll probably pick up some burley to give it a shot as well. I need more taste in my blends and I'm thinking the fire or air cured might help out.

 

[DGBAMA]

The fire cured has a smokey flavor and aroma, think smoke cured.

The dark air is bold tobacco flavor.

I like both. Too much dark air kicks the nicotine past high gear for me. Too much fire cured, and that will be all you taste.

 

[grgfinney]

I have both in my blend along with the red vir and marylan, maybe 4 leaves of fire cured for 3lbs

 

[Freeotatv]

10 percent dark air.

If hand shredding..i may recommend finely shredding this leaf..if you hit thick cuts of this ..it may not taste good...

 

[jwit76]

Alright, so my recent blend is: 40% Maryland (toasted for 15 minutes), 25% red, 25% bright, 10% prilep. I then cased it rather heavily from a home blend, coco, glycerin, fruit extract, licorice, etc., basically a formula I've seen on this forum multiple times.

Verdict: while I feel I'm improving my game in all areas, every batch, what I am lacking is TASTE. My wife is satisfied with it as it's primarily what she's been smoking. I however have become accustomed to the taste of the legendary Marlboro red - the more I get into blending, the more I understand how impressive their achievement has been.

That being said, there is a great feeling of accomplishment creating blends, and I will continue to enjoy the hobby. What I need some advise on at this point is FLAVOR. I'm not looking to duplicate my reds, I'm simply looking to enhance taste. I've learned that casings can only go so far. It seems as if the leaf itself is the most important factor. So what would you all recommend at this point? Although I understand Maryland is in the same family, I'm thinking I need to get my hands on some Burley. Perhaps adding a little fire cured as well?

 

[DonH]

If you want more taste, I would substitute half of the Maryland for Burley. So 20% Maryland, 20% Burley. See how that goes.

 

[Freeotatv]

Either get the threshed toasted burley or the organic tn90

You will probably need to toast the organic tn90

 

[Freeotatv]

The burley will fill the taste void....it provides the body of the smoke that is missing..md adds flavour but doesnt add the body of the flavour

 

[jwit76]

Good feedback, the message seems to be consistent. I'll be giving the burley a go for sure. Still might grab some fire cured for experimentation as well.

 

[Freeotatv]

Current blend is 50% burley.. so you may wana order at least a few lbs of organic if going that route...bc you will use it fairly heavily.
Just throwing this out there...

Dark air offers a strong kick with almost a neutral flavor addiditive...kinda like a governor on the blend...so its not like pulling on air.....i would chop it fine to spread it more evenly....

Fire cured...... may suggest after you blend with dark air first...

Fire cured is a very heavy smoke flavour and may be or may not be what you are looking for....it may overpower your blend..if not chooped finely or too heavy in the blend.