Cow tongue or Silver tongue leaf from Jamaica?

[drinkthekoolaid]

Has anyone heard of "Cow tongue" or "Silver tongue" native to Jamaica? If I skipped over seaching it on this site please feel free to slap me.

I am thinking there is a more dominate nick name for it. Here is some background.

 

[drinkthekoolaid]

If no one here has worked or heard of it I call this hogwash....

"Last year, those rare tobaccos included Jamaican leaf, and it’s back again in this year’s version. General refers to the varietal as Silver Tongue, a type of tobacco grown in Montego Bay. The company says it’s the most expensive filler tobacco in the world"

Sited from here

 

[deluxestogie]

As of about a decade ago, there were around 3000 named tobacco varietals that had been cataloged. Now that the market for overpriced cigars has grown tired of larger and larger decorative cigar bands, the industry has started crossing everything with everything, inevitably calling the result "rare".

Well, gosh. Any home grower who fails to properly bag his tobacco blossom heads can lay claim to "rare" new varieties.

Don't misunderstand me. Some of these recent, intentional crosses have yielded tasty tobacco (e.g. Dominican T-13), but people have been scrambling the tobacco genes for thousands of years. The usual motivator is disease resistance. A bit of recent motivation is "different and still palatable".

Bob

 

[RandyL]

Has anyone heard of "Cow tongue" or "Silver tongue" native to Jamaica? If I skipped over seaching it on this site please feel free to slap me.

I am thinking there is a more dominate nick name for it. Here is some back round.

I believe the name of the leaf is lengua di vaca. Foundation and Espinosa cigars have recently used this leaf in the last couple years

 

[TigerTom]

Something about it from Cigar Aficionado.

Espinosa Blends Jamaican Tobacco In New Cigars | Cigar Aficionado

A new brand from Espinosa Premium Cigars evokes the spirit of Jamaica and its most famous cultural export: music. Two new brands from the Nicaraguan cigarmaker, Espinosa Reggae and Espinosa Reggae Dread, are being produced using a Jamaican tobacco called lengua de vaca, which translates to "cow...

www.cigaraficionado.com

Seems interesting.

 

[CobGuy]

I've had Lengua de Vaca Tacos but never tobacco.

~Darin

 

[TigerTom]

I've had Lengua de Vaca Tacos but never tobacco.

~Darin

Sounds...tasty.

 

[deluxestogie]

Lengua de vaca likely refers specifically to the shape of the leaf. The only lengua de vaca recorded in the ARS-GRIN database was collected by William A. Archer in 1935, from Leon, Guanajuato state and Enarnacion, Jalisco state in Mexico. These are practically the same place, about 80 miles NE of Guadalajara. One is in the seed collection, the other is no longer held.

"From Mexico. Seeds collected by W. A.
Archer, Bureau of Plant Industry. Received April 23, 1936.
-collected December 10, 1935, at Leon, Guanajuato. Cultivated tobacco.
114576. No. 3821. Lengua de vaoa

PI 114576 GRIN-Global

npgsweb.ars-grin.gov

-collected at Encarnacion, Jalisco, December 10, 1935. Cultivated tobacco.
114568. No. 3813. Lengua de Vaca NOT AVAILABLE AT GRIN"

There is nothing about lengua de vaca tobacco from Jamaica in the database. That proves nothing about the latter, but does make one curious.

Bob

 

[RandyL]

Something about it from Cigar Aficionado.

Espinosa Blends Jamaican Tobacco In New Cigars | Cigar Aficionado

A new brand from Espinosa Premium Cigars evokes the spirit of Jamaica and its most famous cultural export: music. Two new brands from the Nicaraguan cigarmaker, Espinosa Reggae and Espinosa Reggae Dread, are being produced using a Jamaican tobacco called lengua de vaca, which translates to "cow...

www.cigaraficionado.com

Seems interesting.

I bought some of the Espinosa cigars and they came with a card describing the tobacco. I’m going to go see if I still have it and I’ll post it if I can.

 

[drinkthekoolaid]

There is nothing about lengua de vaca tobacco from Jamaica in the database. That proves nothing about the latter, but does make one curious.

Bob,

Thanks again for helping to weed through all the marketing B.S. and right to the facts.

 

[deluxestogie]

right to the facts.

The problem is that "the facts" are likely incomplete. Turkish Sirdili leaf varieties are called that because their leaf shapes resemble a "ox tongue". [I'm not sure if that's the appearance of an ox's tongue as it feeds, or the appearance of an ox tongue packaged at the supermarket.] I guess they have oxen in Turkey. But just looking, yet not finding supportive data, means only that you still don't know the answer.

Bob

 

[drinkthekoolaid]

Bob,

Do I have to register to seach the PI in GRIN?

Jamaica Tobacco - Victory Seeds®

A tall ornamental plant with large leaves and attractive flowers.

www.victoryseeds.com

Our seed originated from USDA accession number PI 552315 and is grown for us by David Pendergrass from Tennessee.

 

[deluxestogie]

Do I have to register to seach the PI in GRIN?

No need to register or login. Just go here to start: https://npgsweb.ars-grin.gov/gringlobal/search.aspx

Bob

 

[deluxestogie]

On first looking at Jessica's photos of PI 552315 in the GRIN data, my initial thought is that it appears to be an Orinoco-type flue-cure variety. There is no cow and no tongue anywhere in the documentation. There is not even original accession data, since they got it from Beltsville, MD. AND...wait for it...GRIN classes it as "flue-cure".

Bob

 

[drinkthekoolaid]

Thanks Bob. Here is a video displaying said Cow/Silver Tobacco.

 

[deluxestogie]

My impression is that PI 552315 is not the same variety as that shown in the video.

Leaf tips throughout all the leaves shown (infrequently) in the video (above) appear to be acuminate.

Leaf tips of PI 552315, shown in Jessica's clear photos from GRIN appear to be acute. Also, the vein angle of PI 552315 appears to be more angular, whereas the vein angle of the leaves in the video are more open. Although the auricles of leaves in the video are not clearly shown, they seem to not descend down the stalk. Those of PI 552315 plainly do.

Bob