GreenDragon
Moderator
That Moss though, Lush!!
Making Latakia at Home
- Thread starter deluxestogie
- Start date
-
- Tags
- fire-cured latakia
- Status
Gentlemen, start your chambers.
It's getting to be that time of year for those who wish to participate in the home-made Latakia trials to start thinking about fire-curing their Oriental tobacco with whatever materials they have considered might make something that actually tastes and smells like Latakia (not bacon or barbecue).
@Jitterbugdude has offered to curate the trial. The submissions (details will follow) will be due by 1 JUNE 2020. It takes about 6 weeks of continual fire-curing to end up with black tobacco. Begin with an air-cured or sun-cured Oriental, then subject it to the firing. If you start that over the next month or so, then the finished result will have sufficient time to rest and stabilize, before June 2020.
Once JBD has received all the Latakia submissions, he will then divide them, and send a pure sample of each of them to each of the participants. If there are, say 6 participants, then each participant will receive 6 samples--with blind labels, for your personal comparisons in your own, preferred Latakia pipe blend. So you will need to submit several ounces of your home-made Latakia.
There may be a formal certificate awaiting each member who participates.
Bob
It's getting to be that time of year for those who wish to participate in the home-made Latakia trials to start thinking about fire-curing their Oriental tobacco with whatever materials they have considered might make something that actually tastes and smells like Latakia (not bacon or barbecue).
@Jitterbugdude has offered to curate the trial. The submissions (details will follow) will be due by 1 JUNE 2020. It takes about 6 weeks of continual fire-curing to end up with black tobacco. Begin with an air-cured or sun-cured Oriental, then subject it to the firing. If you start that over the next month or so, then the finished result will have sufficient time to rest and stabilize, before June 2020.
Once JBD has received all the Latakia submissions, he will then divide them, and send a pure sample of each of them to each of the participants. If there are, say 6 participants, then each participant will receive 6 samples--with blind labels, for your personal comparisons in your own, preferred Latakia pipe blend. So you will need to submit several ounces of your home-made Latakia.
There may be a formal certificate awaiting each member who participates.
Bob
As the deadline approaches next summer I will send a PM to all those that want to participate.
It Came as a Vision
The fire-cure chamber that I built 8 years ago consisted of a Brinkmann smoker, minus its lid, and a 30 gallon galvanized garbage can that was anchored on top of it. The can has holes drilled into the bottom, a grill thermometer attached to the upper side, and a pair of bolts on opposite sides near the top, to support a removable, perforated angle iron for hanging the leaf.
Fire and smoke are created in the base pan of the Brinkmann, then fills the can.
From 2011.
Although this works, the utilization of leaf hanging space is truly an inefficient use of the firing fuels. For the past couple of months, I've pondered the question of how I could hang leaf more efficiently in the can, without re-engineering it.
Then...it came to me in a vision, as I was drifting off to sleep last night. So today, I got out some 14 gauge, galvanized wire, a pair of heavy, wire-cutter pliers, and set about doing it.
Although I've considered using that wire before, you can't just loop it like rope through a hole. You can only do a bend. My solution was to insert the wire through a pair of holes in the inverted angle iron, then bend each side over to the opposite side. I realize that sounds awfully simple and obvious, but I was just unable to picture how to do it earlier.
I used the upside-down lid as a crude length gauge for cutting the wire. Then each wire was crimped as much as I could manage at the fold-over, in order to tighten it. They still wobble about, but not too much.
Now right side up, the enhanced angle iron rests on the two side bolts of the can.
When a fire is started, the can will be set on top of the Brinkmann, in place of its lid, and a bungee guy cord will be strung from each can side-handle to one of two steel tent stakes, for stability in wind gusts.
Now, I just need to wait for the Trabzon to finish sun-curing. Then I'll start her up.
Bob
The fire-cure chamber that I built 8 years ago consisted of a Brinkmann smoker, minus its lid, and a 30 gallon galvanized garbage can that was anchored on top of it. The can has holes drilled into the bottom, a grill thermometer attached to the upper side, and a pair of bolts on opposite sides near the top, to support a removable, perforated angle iron for hanging the leaf.
Fire and smoke are created in the base pan of the Brinkmann, then fills the can.
From 2011.
Although this works, the utilization of leaf hanging space is truly an inefficient use of the firing fuels. For the past couple of months, I've pondered the question of how I could hang leaf more efficiently in the can, without re-engineering it.
Then...it came to me in a vision, as I was drifting off to sleep last night. So today, I got out some 14 gauge, galvanized wire, a pair of heavy, wire-cutter pliers, and set about doing it.
Although I've considered using that wire before, you can't just loop it like rope through a hole. You can only do a bend. My solution was to insert the wire through a pair of holes in the inverted angle iron, then bend each side over to the opposite side. I realize that sounds awfully simple and obvious, but I was just unable to picture how to do it earlier.
I used the upside-down lid as a crude length gauge for cutting the wire. Then each wire was crimped as much as I could manage at the fold-over, in order to tighten it. They still wobble about, but not too much.
Now right side up, the enhanced angle iron rests on the two side bolts of the can.
When a fire is started, the can will be set on top of the Brinkmann, in place of its lid, and a bungee guy cord will be strung from each can side-handle to one of two steel tent stakes, for stability in wind gusts.
Now, I just need to wait for the Trabzon to finish sun-curing. Then I'll start her up.
Bob
GreenDragon
Moderator
Bob, what temperature range do you try to maintain?
Below is a distribution of ignition temperatures for various kinds of paper, fabric and wood. As you can see, none of these ignites below 400°F.
On my grill thermometer, situated 4 or 5 inches from the top of the can, I aim for any temp below the vertical (green arrow), even though it could get well past the yellow arrow (400°F) without igniting. So long as the thermometer is happy, and I see smoke, then I consider it going well.
Below is the current state of my Trabzon. Once the leaf is strung on my handy dandy leaf rack, I'll try to keep the smoker going all day, every day for about 5 or 6 weeks, or whenever the leaf is black.
Bob
On my grill thermometer, situated 4 or 5 inches from the top of the can, I aim for any temp below the vertical (green arrow), even though it could get well past the yellow arrow (400°F) without igniting. So long as the thermometer is happy, and I see smoke, then I consider it going well.
Below is the current state of my Trabzon. Once the leaf is strung on my handy dandy leaf rack, I'll try to keep the smoker going all day, every day for about 5 or 6 weeks, or whenever the leaf is black.
Bob
What are you going to use for fuel?
Myself, I'm waiting for a supply of wood that I ordered from Syria..
Myself, I'm waiting for a supply of wood that I ordered from Syria..
I've been accumulating various woods from my yard that tested as "favorable": lilac wood, forsythia wood, English lavender stems, oregano stems, dried mint stems, honeysuckle stems, red cedar (juniper) wood and dead foliage, some brown pine needles, some tears of Chios, and maybe some well-dried sweet gum pods, if I can get some more before the fire-curing is done. (I might have to make an unscheduled trip to the parking lot of the Salem VA Hospital with a large tub and a snow shovel.) I may also add some green juniper brush.
It will be a challenge to keep fires going for 40+ days with what I have on hand right now. I may have to use some well-dried pine branches. On my previous attempt, I used some of the abundant silver maple deadfall, but I suspect that it gave me the wrong aromas. I also used charcoal to keep it all going, which I believe also contributed to the wrong aroma. A forever propane burner might do the trick, but I'm not going to figure out how to rig that up safely.
Bob
EDIT: Here is my fire-curing materials data sheet as of today:
It will be a challenge to keep fires going for 40+ days with what I have on hand right now. I may have to use some well-dried pine branches. On my previous attempt, I used some of the abundant silver maple deadfall, but I suspect that it gave me the wrong aromas. I also used charcoal to keep it all going, which I believe also contributed to the wrong aroma. A forever propane burner might do the trick, but I'm not going to figure out how to rig that up safely.
Bob
EDIT: Here is my fire-curing materials data sheet as of today:
Last edited:
I just now test-burned some dry, brown lilac leaf. It's a loser.
Bob
Bob
Dry run today. I used some very dry, very well cured silver maple wood to build a small fire in the chamber, then assembled it all. It's a polite invitation to the spiders to consider spinning their webs in a better location.
I discovered that one of my bungee cords is rather frayed. I've reinforced that one with some wire, to prevent the can from being toppled off, should it suddenly snap. But I'll shop for new ones.
Smoke gently wafts from the can lid. It distinctly smells like maple wood. So I can't use that for the real deal. The temp seems to cruise at about 200°F, which is fine.
Inch by inch, I'm getting closer to actually doing this.
For any members waffling about whether or not to give home Latakia making a try, there's a wall certificate in it for each participant.
Bob
EDIT: You are free to use purchased Oriental leaf for this trial. It doesn't have to be home grown, just home-fired. The variety doesn't matter. [Sorry, you can't submit purchased Latakia.]
I discovered that one of my bungee cords is rather frayed. I've reinforced that one with some wire, to prevent the can from being toppled off, should it suddenly snap. But I'll shop for new ones.
Smoke gently wafts from the can lid. It distinctly smells like maple wood. So I can't use that for the real deal. The temp seems to cruise at about 200°F, which is fine.
Inch by inch, I'm getting closer to actually doing this.
For any members waffling about whether or not to give home Latakia making a try, there's a wall certificate in it for each participant.
Bob
EDIT: You are free to use purchased Oriental leaf for this trial. It doesn't have to be home grown, just home-fired. The variety doesn't matter. [Sorry, you can't submit purchased Latakia.]
Last edited:
One way to do this without a Brinkmann smoker for the base is to use two identical steel trash cans. Remove most of the bottom from one can--leaving a rim of it for strength, which would be inverted over a fire pit of any kind, and serve as the base. Some tiles or bricks for spacers would allow air beneath it. Bore a bunch of holes into the bottom of the second can, which will serve to hold the tobacco. For stability, a grill, with aluminum foil on both sides (except in the center) is placed between them. It won't matter if some smoke leaks.
If you keep the fire small, you probably don't even need a thermometer. To generate the most smoke, I'll wrap my flavorant twigs into a foil pack that is punctured on top with a fork.
Bob
If you keep the fire small, you probably don't even need a thermometer. To generate the most smoke, I'll wrap my flavorant twigs into a foil pack that is punctured on top with a fork.
Bob
Trying to make my own latakia is on my list, but this year is clearly too soon for me (I have not gathered the required woods and materials and I already have difficulties findind enough spare time for taking care of all the things I have to do... ).
But I will follow your experimentations with great interest !
).But I will follow your experimentations with great interest !
Well, Charly, I've thought about this last and final piece of the pipe tobacco puzzle for the past decade. My one and only attempt to make Latakia (2011) provided some useful parameters, but just didn't (and still doesn't) taste like Latakia. It tastes like a mild and unique fire-cured tobacco--tasty, but not Latakia. It's been a nagging failure.
Latakia was invented by, and continues to be manufactured (for the time being) by simple folks, who just used the tobacco and the materials on hand. The same is true of perique and Cavendish tobacco. But Latakia production has vanished or nearly vanished from the area of Latakia, Syria--due to environmental concerns (and a fatwa), and is under some pressure to cease in Cyprus.
Attempting to make Latakia at home, on the tiny scale at which we do things, is time consuming, and tedious, and maybe even expensive (per pound of tobacco)--depending on the source of the materials, especially when compared to making Cavendish or perique. The more members who attempt this simultaneously, the greater the probability that one of us may at least come close to the magic, hopefully sooner rather than later.
I'm expecting 6 or fewer members to participate in the Latakia trial. That's about the same number involved in the perique trials some years ago. But the perique trials, even with such a small number, nonetheless proved that anybody can make very nice perique at home, and economically. I hope to do the same with the Latakia trials.
One last consideration. Giving this a try, and not succeeding in ending up with Latakia, simply means that you've made some very lovely and unique fire-cured pipe blending tobacco--all on your own. That's something to be content with. [And you get a wall certificate to remind you that you are a pioneer.]
Once we've cracked this nut, Latakia tobacco will be saved from likely extinction.
Bob
Latakia was invented by, and continues to be manufactured (for the time being) by simple folks, who just used the tobacco and the materials on hand. The same is true of perique and Cavendish tobacco. But Latakia production has vanished or nearly vanished from the area of Latakia, Syria--due to environmental concerns (and a fatwa), and is under some pressure to cease in Cyprus.
Attempting to make Latakia at home, on the tiny scale at which we do things, is time consuming, and tedious, and maybe even expensive (per pound of tobacco)--depending on the source of the materials, especially when compared to making Cavendish or perique. The more members who attempt this simultaneously, the greater the probability that one of us may at least come close to the magic, hopefully sooner rather than later.
I'm expecting 6 or fewer members to participate in the Latakia trial. That's about the same number involved in the perique trials some years ago. But the perique trials, even with such a small number, nonetheless proved that anybody can make very nice perique at home, and economically. I hope to do the same with the Latakia trials.
One last consideration. Giving this a try, and not succeeding in ending up with Latakia, simply means that you've made some very lovely and unique fire-cured pipe blending tobacco--all on your own. That's something to be content with. [And you get a wall certificate to remind you that you are a pioneer.]
Once we've cracked this nut, Latakia tobacco will be saved from likely extinction.
Bob
GreenDragon
Moderator
Everyone, let me introduce you to Morag, my new-to-me smoker.
Normally I don’t like uni-taskers, but the wife refused to let me use the grill for this experiment. Normally when I want to smoke something I use $0.10 worth of aluminum foil to stuff the vents on my gas grill and add a couple handfuls of wood chips to another wad of foil. Very effective (and cheap) and I can control the temperature by adding or subtracting the amount of vent blocked with the foil with one burner on its lowest setting.
With that option nixed I contemplated setting up a rig like Bob’s, but on a whim I decided to check Craigslist and found this for a song. Bonus - was in my neighborhood!
Next need to hit the nature trail and collect some Juniper.
Normally I don’t like uni-taskers, but the wife refused to let me use the grill for this experiment. Normally when I want to smoke something I use $0.10 worth of aluminum foil to stuff the vents on my gas grill and add a couple handfuls of wood chips to another wad of foil. Very effective (and cheap) and I can control the temperature by adding or subtracting the amount of vent blocked with the foil with one burner on its lowest setting.
With that option nixed I contemplated setting up a rig like Bob’s, but on a whim I decided to check Craigslist and found this for a song. Bonus - was in my neighborhood!
Next need to hit the nature trail and collect some Juniper.
Alpine
Moderator
Ah... that looks professional equipment! I will follow with interest.
pier
pier
Nice looking smoker. I would be inclined to remove all but the top rack, and hang the leaf from it. Maybe drill new holes for that top rack, near the top of the box.
Bob
Bob
GreenDragon
Moderator
So I’ve been playing with my new toy this afternoon and made an interesting discovery. On a whim I threw in some dry tobacco stems from my recent harvest. I grabbed a handful of dry stems and broke them up and threw them in the smoker. Wow what a unique scent. Not in line with Latakia at all, but I think would be awesome for fire curing Kentucky etc. A wonderful earthy, caramel odor. There’s gold in them thar stalks guys.
I waited through the end of last week and Saturday for the winds from Dorian (yes, even way over here) to pass, before sitting on my porch with an open bushel basket of Trabzon, in order to mount the leaf on the fire-cure rack. The basket was left on the porch for the overnight dew, covered with Agribon AG-15.
I got up a 6 am Sunday, to catch the humidity, before it fell. No joy. A lit match would have ignited it all like a flash bulb going off. I misted the leaf last night, then checked it again this morning. Still bone dry.
Then it occurred to me that this stuff will be going into a fire-curing chamber. It doesn't matter how wet the leaf is to start out. So I transferred the leaf, handful by handful--spraying it along the way--into a large plastic bag. Once the leaf is in high case, I'll mount it all, and begin my voyage into the unknown.
Bob
Using the inverted can lid to hold the leaf rack, I stacked and stuffed leaf onto each of the wires. The rack was then turned right side up, and placed into the smoker can. It's ready to go. This is the batch of leaf that I will run. (You are looking at it still inverted.) I could have fit five times as much tobacco onto the rack, but as it is, it was a bit tricky to get it into the can.
I'll start firing it twice a day tomorrow.
Bob
Shockingly, the lid of a steel trash can is not vapor proof. This run is fired entirely with lilac wood, which, from its present burning aroma, will make a respectable background aroma for Latakia.
Bob
EDIT: For tinder, I use a rolled up sheet of paper towel to get the kindling twigs (lilac in this instance) ignited. No starter fluid. Just a BIC lighter. I'll try to remember to take a photo of the next firewood build, before I light it.
- Status
Similar threads
