Working with Mason jars

[Copenhagen Forever]

I want to get my head wrapped around this technique. I've watched my mother "can" stewed tomatoes using Mason jars when I was young. I remember the rack she had in the boil pot. Those tomatoes lasted years in the cellar. Is this what your doing when you use the Mason jars? That would be the perfect system for storing and aging dip.

 

[squeezyjohn]

This technique isn't really the same as canning because you can't actually seal the jars straight after you make the stuff, it has to breathe as it ages for a month or so. Mold spores can and do get on your snus using my method and sometimes produce visible mold patches after several months. Refrigeration is a good way of stopping this. I use freezing for long term storage. It would be interesting to see if you could can it and seal it for storage by boiling it up after it has breathed, but I've never tried it.

Basically I use kilner jars (same thing this side of the pond) because they are strong and made of glass which will impart no flavour to the finished product, and the reason I use any jar at all in the process is because a second container suspended in a water bath gives a much more even temperature so the method is controlled. If you just stuff the crockpot full of your snus mixture it will heat through, but unevenly with the bit touching the pot getting much hotter and the centre not heating up enough. It would work fine if it was constantly stirred, but I don't have anything which could do that for me.

 

[Copenhagen Forever]

I bought some "Ball" canning jars today. I'm going to make a rack to hold them as they sit upright in the crockpot. I'll twist up some 3/16 rod to hold the jars with maybe a strap going over the top of them both to stop them from floating up. I might have a counter counter weight to sink the whole set up. The jars are 16 oz. and should hold a good charge of tobacco in each.
Does the jar have to breath in only one direction, out, A simple reel valve might be pop riveted in the lid.
The thing is, I haven't let any of my dip breath other than when it take it out of the plastic container after cooking and put it in baby jars. I put my last 2 batches in sandwich bags so unless there's going to be a pressure build up I might as well try sealing the Ball jars when the cook is over. I really don't have any objectionable smell or taste the way I'm doing it. I only smell the ammonia from the baker's salt.

 

[squeezyjohn]

For making the snus - I don't have the jars fully sealed due to expansion that you get during heating ... it's not really for breathing purposes. In the ageing I have them the same way which is to allow ammonia gas produced to escape as that is desirable for the taste. The ammonia is normally given off when you add the alkali after the cook ... if your recipe doesn't do this then you won't notice it as much.

 

[deluxestogie]

Ball (the company) makes 1-piece plastic lids for both standard and wide-mouth Mason jars. They are fairly expensive. While plastic lids should NOT be used during heat processing, they are ideal for jars that may be stored in the refrigerator, and opened repeatedly. This is true for food as well as tobacco.

If you use standard mouth Mason jars of any capacity, there is a much less expensive option.

Standard mayonaise jars use a lid that perfectly matches a standard mouth Mason jar.

In the image below, the middle lid is one of the expensive Ball plastic lids. To its left is the lid from the mayo jar shown in the first image. The threads (the only thing that matters) match perfectly.

If gas builds up within a sealed Mason jar with a traditional two-part lid, the lid will "pop," and vent itself (if sufficient pressure accumulates). The somewhat rigid plastic seal of the Ball or mayo plastic lids makes a good, but not air-tight seal. So they vent as well, but without the visual cue of "popping."

Bob

 

[Copenhagen Forever]

OK, I'll do my cooking with the 2 piece Ball lids loosely on so my moisture stays in. When the cooking is over I'll switch to the plastic lids for the 2 weeks in the refrigerator.
Then I'll boil them in a pan while checking the temp in the middle of the tobacco. When it reaches, say 205 or so I'll cap them with the 2 piece again tight.
I should be able to store them at room temp for years.

Thanks a lot guy's for helping. It's a lot of typing for a greenhorn but I appreciate it.

This morning I'm able to dip into a batch thats been sitting in the fridge for a full 2 weeks and it is some....good with my coffee. It very similar to copenhagen. Rich and full of flavor. I'm thoroughly happy with it. It blows the doors of any store bought dips like kodiak natural or longhorn natural.
Very Cool

 

[Jitterbugdude]

I pit my lids on as tight as possible. Since the jars are completely submerged in water the pressure is uniform around the entire jar.

 

[Copenhagen Forever]

JBD, So you pack your jars full? Do they float? Have you ever had a jar fail?
I'm almost ready to cook again. I got 12 oz of burly flour and I'll go thru some air cured today. I was going to make a rack to hold the jars upright but if I can tighten the jars up I won't have to. Thanks

 

[Jitterbugdude]

Yup.. I pack them full and they float. I have a piece of heavy metal bar that I lay on top of the jar to keep it under water. I also put a screen on the bottom so the jars don't rest directly on the surface of the crockpot.
I've never had a jar fail but then again I've only done a few dozen.

 

[Copenhagen Forever]

Started cooking with jars today. I got enough tobacco processed to cram 4 jars but my crock only holds 2. I'll be cooking for 6 days to get it all done. My jars fit the crock good and float top up. I didn't know what to expect but there floating about a 1/2" above, no need for a rack. I made a dimmer set up and already marked my temp set places. I watched the temp carefully on last dip I made and marked 185*, 192* and 205* f. I'll cook at 185 this time, a little worried about pressure build up. I'll try to weigh the jars down tomorrow. I got some plastic screen somewhere around here.

 

[Copenhagen Forever]

Do I replace the lid each time I cook?

 

[Smokin Harley]

Started cooking with jars today. I got enough tobacco processed to cram 4 jars but my crock only holds 2. I'll be cooking for 6 days to get it all done. My jars fit the crock good and float top up. I didn't know what to expect but there floating about a 1/2" above, no need for a rack. I made a dimmer set up and already marked my temp set places. I watched the temp carefully on last dip I made and marked 185*, 192* and 205* f. I'll cook at 185 this time, a little worried about pressure build up. I'll try to weigh the jars down tomorrow. I got some plastic screen somewhere around here.

ok, I'm no electrician and I don't know which dimmer or what kind of system you have built but I think there are light dimmers and there are fan dimmers . to make sure you don't ruin the electronics of the crock I think you need the fan dimmer switch .

 

[Smokin Harley]

Do I replace the lid each time I cook?

I don't ,but you're supposed to. I don't screw them down too tight, once the jars cool off they suck on tight enough. I'm kinda frugal that way.

 

[Jitterbugdude]

I don't replace my lids either but I do crank them down tight and put a weight on top so the jars do not float.
How are you measuring your temp to calibrate your dimmer switch? I use a Ranco thermostat and place the temp probe into the water.

 

[Copenhagen Forever]

ok, I'm no electrician and I don't know which dimmer or what kind of system you have built but I think there are light dimmers and there are fan dimmers . to make sure you don't ruin the electronics of the crock I think you need the fan dimmer switch .

I didn't give what kind of dimmer any though, I read the package and it said 600 amps so I wired it up using an old extension cord ends. The crock is on high and I just watched the temp climb and then leveled it off with the dial. It sits at 180* and doesn't move. I had to watch it a good part of the day. The mark I made for 195 was with the plastic tub I was cooking with. The jars don't insulate as much so it's at 180*. That were I want to be this cook. Eventually I'll get a thermostat.
The jars are a little more work to the stirring part of the process. It's a lot easier to just dump out the plastic tub, stir and put it back in. I worry about have tobacco on the thread of the lid and not sealing which leads me to the question ; Do you guys stir your tobacco every day?

 

[Smokin Harley]

I've got 3 mason jars of "not quite pressure cooker cavendish" and another jar of what I was going to do as regular crockpot cavendish(with water,but I'd need to babysit a crockpot ) ...in my kiln.
Since the safety plug blew out of the PC I had to think of another way to continue the processing. I have the kiln already, the tobaccos were in jars already and were in need of a long term controllable heat source.
. I normally have my crockpot in the bottom of the foam lined plywood kiln that serves for heat and in part, humidity. Normally I would hang leaf from the wire shelving and let it ride for a week before refilling the stainless steel water vessel I have nested in sand within the crockpot. Ok thats a re-cap of how I normally do it ,but now...a little twist to the plot as they say.
I have a 4 quart electric roaster (thrift store purchase) that already has a porcelain coated steel food liner. It also has a temperature control integral to the roaster,which starts at 150*F .I have it set to 200 and a little more ,next setting is 250 . I put sand in and around my canning jars full of tobacco,lids on. so the sand absorbs the heat as a mass and keeps it even around the jars surface without any cold spots (my theory anyway) The temperature probe hangs in the top portion of the kiln and the digital controller is set to maintain for now at 120*F within the kiln. Now, with it arranged this way ,I can adjust the heat just short of a boiling point and let the heat go as long as I need to without opening the kiln ,which would otherwise allow mass quantities of humidity out and having to recover upon its closing. The moisture within the jars is sealed in, and never escapes just as if it was in the pressure cooker method.
I'm going to let it run as is at 120*F for a week and see how the tobacco looks. Then I will open the jars and check for aroma. After that point I'll try turning the heat up some more, like 175*F for a week again and recheck and so on. I am hoping to get to as close to 212 as I can and hopefully for a week. rechecking along the way.

 

[Copenhagen Forever]

Looks like you get it under control. I not sure what cavendish is. I thought it was a pipe tobacco. It's a shame the your pressure cooker broke but it looks like you got a backup plan. I'd like to see pic's of your setup if you can. I can follow most of what your explaining but I'm still pretty green with some of the processes you guy's are cooking with.

 

[Smokin Harley]

yes , cavendish is pipe tobacco(method and cut).
Not sure if it applies to what you're doing but offering an optional method for you to try ...in time maybe.

 

[deluxestogie]

CF,
The Cavendish process is one in which color-cured leaf is steamed, in order to sweeten and darken it. Steaming it in a colander in a standard pot for ~8 hours provides roughly the same result as pressure-cooking it for 5 hours. The heat and moisture soften and darken the leaf.

Here's the original thread on the topic: http://fairtradetobacco.com/threads/637-Making-Black-Cavendish-Pipe-Tobacco

Bob

 

[Copenhagen Forever]

Hey that's very cool. Now I understand what Smokin Harley is talking about. That is almost like what you get cooking dip in a sealed jar with moisture without salt. There isn't enough moisture to wash away the nicotine. It tuns black. Is that what your trying to achieve Smokin? You going to smoke the dip?
Thank for the link. I'll bookmark it and try to make some.